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| SIDE ONE | ||
| 0:00 | Start of Side One / silence | |
| 0:07 | INTRO MUSIC | |
| 0:22 | Lasner | This is Rich Lasner for Ibanez guitars. This limited edition Phil Collen interview picture disk was recorded on December 8th at ??? Studios in Amsterdam, where Def Leppard is hard at work on their new album. On side one, Phil talks with Peter Mensch from Def Leppard management about his equipment, influences, and getting his personal sound. Let's join them as Phil tells Peter how he came to be a member of the group. |
| Mensch | How did you get into Def Leppard? I mean: let's be frank. Let's tell 'em the truth, exactly. | |
| Collen | Alright...um...Pete Willis - the other guitar player - quit and, uh, I've known Joe and Steve for a while and Joe just phoned up and said, "do you wanna come down and help us out in the studio?" So, I did and everyone was impressed with what I did. We just carried on from there. | |
| 1:08 | Mensch | So, what would you advise for, you know, young players - you know, young American players - in terms of, you know, heavy metal and stuff like that or hard rock, or false metal, or true metal? |
| Collen | Just listen to everyone. Don't listen to just one person or you'll sound like everyone else does in LA, I say. There are some amazing guitar players but they all sound the same. | |
| Mensch | How would you avoid sounding like everybody else? | |
| Collen | Just, just have lots of different influences. I mean, I used to listen to a lot of jazz, as well, and... | |
| Mensch | I mean, like what? Old, like, Joe Pass? | |
| Collen | Yeah, Joe Pass, Al Di Meola and stuff like that. | |
| Mensch | Is there anything else to tell young kids to do or something like that? I mean... | |
| Collen | Well, now, see a lot of kids just listen to Eddie Van Halen, full stop. In fact, you're getting people now who listen to people who listen to... | |
| Mensch | Eddie Van Halen sort of third removed. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | I mean, is there any advantage if...in a guitar player if he sits there and knows, you know, much more about his guitar, to be able to rewire it himself and stuff like that? Have you ever found the need? I mean, I know that Eddie, for example, you know, does his own guitar work or something like that. | |
| 2:01 | Collen | Yeah. |
| Mensch | You know, I mean, maybe he's quite proud of it. I mean, do you have a particular interest in, you know, in rewiting your own guitar? Brian May does his own guitar work. | |
| Collen | Yeah, not really. I know what needs to be done to it but I don't know how to do it. | |
| Mensch | Right. I mean, but basically, the Destroyer comes pretty well equipped the way you like. | |
| Collen | Yeah, very well. | |
| Mensch | I mean, there's not a lot of work to be done to it. | |
| Collen | No. | |
| Mensch | And you don't recommend that new guitar players have to sit there and learn the guts of their guitars... | |
| Collen | Well, if they, you know, if they want to. If they've got a burning passion to do it... | |
| Mensch | But it's not a major thing in terms of... | |
| Collen | I don't think so. | |
| Mensch | You've got a couple other Destroyers. Are they equipped differently? With different pick-ups? And, if so, you know, what for? | |
| Collen | Well, that...that one used to be... | |
| Mensch | Better talk into the microphone. | |
| Collen | *laughs* Excuse me, pointing at that 'cuz I know you really can't see what I'm doing but I've got one here that's all black and it used to be the other one's sister. It used to go...it used to be my spare guitar. | |
| Mensch | Right, but you've changed the pick-ups on it. | |
| Collen | Yeah, new Ibanez pick-ups. They're...really powerful and that so, hopefully, I'll be using that... | |
| Mensch | Yeah, they're, uh, different from the other ones you've got on your original one. | |
| 3:01 | Collen | Yeah. |
| Mensch | What, what's the difference between the two? | |
| Collen | Well, they're just... | |
| Mensch | Louder? | |
| Collen | Yeah, I think so, in general. | |
| Mensch | But it's basically the neck and the fretboard are still basically the same. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | How did you get involved? Did they just come to the gig one day? Were you headlining Budokan? What happened? | |
| Collen | We were doing just a little gig. I forget what it was called. It was about 3000 seats. And they come up with some guitars, some of the guys: Nero and Ned and all that lot. And said, "would you like to try this?" And I was so impressed with the Destroyer that I had them build me one...to, like, me own specifications. | |
| Mensch | What were you playing before you were playing a Destroyer? | |
| Collen | A Les Paul or a Strat. | |
| Mensch | But you saw the shape of the Destroyer... | |
| Collen | Yeah, it looked cool. | |
| Mensch | Cool. | |
| Collen | It looked cool on me. | |
| Mensch | So you played, picked up the guitar. Was it a factory model? Were they specially made? Was it a production line thing? | |
| Collen | Yeah, the first one was just a production line one that, you know, that...a red one, just a standard Destroyer. | |
| Mensch | And you liked the shape of it? | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | And you had them make you one over in what color? What changes did you have them make on it? | |
| 4:02 | Collen | I had them put a tremolo arm on it, three pick-ups, and black and me name on it. And some square inlays. |
| Mensch | It was just the shape of the guitar you liked about it, mostly? | |
| Collen | No, it just felt good, it plays well, and they're all pretty consistent. Umm, all the Destroyers, they all feel good to play whereas a lot of Gibsons and whatever are just totally different. | |
| Mensch | On your solos on Pyromania, didn't you use a Destroyer? | |
| Collen | Yeah, on all the solos. | |
| Mensch | When you're on stage, what do you...what kind of amplifiers, what kind of amplification do you use on stage? | |
| Collen | Marshalls. 50s | |
| Mensch | How many? One? Three? | |
| Collen | Two. | |
| Mensch | Seven? A wall of Marshalls? | |
| Collen | No...no... | |
| Mensch | What about the cabinets? | |
| Collen | Just Marshall cabs as well. Two amps..and three cabs. | |
| Mensch | What about in the studio? That's a whole different situation. | |
| Collen | That's a different ballgame. We just go for whatever sounds good. Maybe that Marshall over there. | |
| Mensch | Alright. What's, what's that Marshall called? | |
| Collen | It's Valerie | |
| 4:52 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 5:18 | Mensch | What about, umm, you know, the pick-ups? You use...what? Two Ibanez pick-ups and what else? |
| Collen | Yeah, I've got three pick-ups on the Destroyer and the two...the middle and the bass pick-up are both Ibanez ones and just the treble pick-up's a DiMarzio Super Distortion. | |
| Mensch | Any reason why you changed over to the DiMarzio Super Distortion? | |
| Collen | Not really. Just always used them on Les Pauls and whatever guitars I've had. I'm more comfortable with them. | |
| Mensch | Why do you use a metal pick-up? A metal, uh, pick. Sorry. | |
| Collen | Because plastic ones break. Because I play fairly hard. | |
| Mensch | Do you?! | |
| Collen | Oh, yeah. It gives a different sound. | |
| Mensch | Have you always used a metal pick? | |
| Collen | Yeah, pretty much. | |
| Mensch | I've always liked a metal pick. | |
| Collen | Yeah, they look good and all. | |
| Mensch | You have a guitar roadie. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| 6:00 | Mensch | Right. That's Mike Rogers. How does that usually work on stage? Mike sets up the guitars for you and you know... |
| Collen | Mike does everything. I don't have to do a thing. He just hands me the guitars. He plays all the stuff. I just mime there. | |
| Mensch | *laughs* | |
| Collen | And look cool. | |
| Mensch | No, but basically, Mike just...Mike tunes everything up for you. Do you tune the guitar again before you go on stage or just leave it to Mike? | |
| Collen | Mike does it. He's got special techniques to tune it as well as *unintelligible*. He certainly knows more about it than I do. | |
| Mensch | Exactly. But basically, he hands you the guitar and you're away. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | And...and that's basically the way it works. | |
| 6:31 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 6:49 | Mensch | In terms of using an aerial versus a cord, a cord...I mean, a cord is much better sounding. |
| Collen | Definitely. It's a much purer signal. I think so. | |
| Mensch | I think, I think most people would agree. But we...we use an aerial because you like to move around a lot. It gives you flexibility. | |
| Collen | Yeah. It's still not perfect but...Steve seems to quite like it anyway, I think. With the sound. Me, personally, I...I don't like the extra top end and whatever that comes with the aerial. | |
| Mensch | Really? | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | So it's mostly top end, extra top on the aerial? | |
| Collen | Yeah. I mean, every once in a while you'll lose bottom end or something before I started using an aerial but it's the really high top I couldn't get...I couldn't get rid of it. | |
| Mensch | Is top really important to your sound, basically? In terms of distortion? | |
| Collen | Well, usually, I just plug into a Marshall and it sounds pretty good anyway, just with it cold... | |
| Mensch | Right. | |
| Collen | ...with the Destroyer but, umm...aerials don't really... | |
| Mensch | How would you, how would you describe the difference...why is it, you know, a lot of bands...in fact, this band in particular, can just set up your basic two Marshall 50s and three, and three cabs, is that what you said? And in, you know, but in the studio, you go through a lot more, you know, painstaking process. Why is it that you don't use the live sound in the studio? | |
| 7:54 | Collen | With the live sound, you've got a lot of other things going off. You've got the drum kit in the background, everything's loud, and everything's it's exciting, and you're playing an arena and you've got... |
| Mensch | Arena acoustics. | |
| Collen | Yeah. And stuff like that. In here it's very clinical. | |
| Mensch | So, you can actually end up playing through one Marshall and one cabinet. | |
| Collen | Definitely. That's what we're doing at the moment. | |
| Mensch | Doing at the moment. | |
| Collen | Most of the time, yeah. | |
| Mensch | You know, is there any logic in playing through more than one in the studio? | |
| Collen | It depends, I mean... | |
| Mensch | What you want. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | Will Def Leppard ever do that at all? | |
| Collen | Yeah. When we get on to the solos. When we start linking up amps and things. | |
| Mensch | Will you ever use the, uh, the cordless in the studio? | |
| Collen | No, you see, I don't like them, full stop. | |
| Mensch | Stop. | |
| Collen | It's a...it's just a personal thing. I don't...I don't like them. | |
| Mensch | Ever think about going back to a cord? | |
| Collen | I can't now, cuz I trip over them. | |
| Mensch | Right. | |
| Collen | I've gotten so used to it on the stage. | |
| Mensch | OK. Let's talk a little bit more about, um, about your, you know, your guitar roadie. I mean, in terms of, we've already mentioned he does all the tuning and, you know, the restringing. Do you have...do you give him suggestions about how, in terms of what kind of strings you want? Gauges and stuff like that? And the...the pick-ups you want to use? Or, I mean, does he sit there and suggest things to you in terms of ... | |
| 9:00 | Collen | Mike, uh, suggests a lot of things to me. I mean, I basically tell him about, you know, what pick-ups and whatever, um, plectrums and that...but...he's got lots of little tips and things to add, too. |
| Mensch | Is it good having a guitar roadie who's a guitar player himself? | |
| Collen | I think so, yeah. | |
| Mensch | Does it help, you know, in terms of, um, giving you advice and stuff like that? | |
| Collen | Yeah, I think so. | |
| Mensch | But you don't have that many problems with the Destroyer on stage, do you, it doesn't go out of tune at all. | |
| Collen | Nah, it's great. | |
| Mensch | And you almost never break a string, I think. | |
| Collen | I think...I never broke a string all last year on this Destroyer. I've done it once on a Les Paul, I think. | |
| Mensch | So, it's not that reason is it because, is it...you've done a lot of things to the Destroyer, like bend the neck and stuff like that. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | You do a lot of that. Is the Destroyer well built for things like that? | |
| Collen | Yeah. It seems to hold up. It's the same one. | |
| Mensch | Right. Exactly. You've been using for seven or eight years. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | *unintelligible* | |
| Collen | *unintelligible*...fair old time. | |
| Mensch | *unintelligible*...seven years | |
| 9:50 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 10:16 | silence | |
| 10:24 | End of Side One | |
| SIDE TWO | ||
| 0:00 | Start of Side Two / silence | |
| 0:06 | Lasner | Hi, and welcome back. On side two, Peter speaks with Phil about his favorite solos and practicing techniques. Phil begins by talking about soloing. |
| 0:18 | Mensch | Did you do much practicing, you know, what kind of schedule did you follow? Did you play just chords, or scales, or all those things that guitar players do periodically? |
| Collen | Yeah, and I still do them...actually, when I'm waiting between takes. So, I mean, when I first started, I used to practice, like, eight hours a day sometimes. | |
| Mensch | Did you, did you practice other people's solos and things like that? | |
| Collen | No, always me own solos, but...I'd nip licks off of other people. | |
| Mensch | But you never learned someone's solos by heart. | |
| Collen | Not really, no. | |
| Mensch | Do you recommend that as a technique for people or do you think they should just try to be as inventive as possible? | |
| Collen | Just do what feels natural, really. I've never felt that comfortable ripping off a solo I didn't record. | |
| Mensch | Why did you decide you have to use a tremolo vis-a-vis, for example, other guitar players don't even have one on their guitar. | |
| Collen | Because Eddie used one, man. *laughs* | |
| 1:00 | Mensch | But you know, I mean, you didn't follow anybody in terms of technique on tremolo, did you? |
| Collen | Actually, yeah. Ritchie Blackmore. He'd done it years ago and it just developed to such a stage where you can actually use them really a lot and not go out of tune. | |
| 1:19 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 2:40 | Mensch | So, basically, until the advent of the tremolo arm that kept the strings in tune... |
| Collen | We struggled. | |
| Mensch | We struggled and now we don't struggle anymore. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | That's fair enough. How do you come up with your solos for an album? Is it just any particular inspiration for a solo or do you just figure out what, you know, it's fast, slow...you know...what | |
| Collen | Yeah. You just...figure the mood of the song, you know, that's what type of solo you do. You don't just go in there and blast away regardless like a lot of people though I won't give any names but I could...uh....certainly think of a list... | |
| 3:05 | Mensch | You could name a lot of names. |
| Collen | You have to...it's got to be like a vocal thing almost. Like a melody line. Otherwise there's not much point in putting it in. | |
| Mensch | But you don't want to advise someone...it's like the famous "let's see how many notes I can play in thirty seconds for every solo I do". | |
| Collen | No, I used to do that...and I still do on stage but...let me see that *unintelligible* more important. | |
| Mensch | More important. | |
| 3:24 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 3:49; | Mensch | You and Steve Clark and Rick Savage have written most of the music on the album... |
| Collen | Mmmm | |
| Mensch | ...the forthcoming album. How do you and Steve...how do you three come up with ideas? You play them to each other? For example, on...ummm...Animal, one of the tracks you'll be hearing the next several months when the Def Leppard album comes out | |
| 4:06 | Collen | You're not supposed to tell them the titles. |
| Mensch | Why not? I've told them some titles already in the fan club. | |
| Collen | Oh, really? | |
| Mensch | Yeah. How did that song come about? Did you write it with Steve? Or, you know, Sav? Did Sav contribute, you know...you know, uhh, the choruses, the verses? Just how does that... | |
| Collen | On that particular one, I had...a riff floating around for a while and...while we were on tour, as well, just...I had a few ideas about it. Ummm, we basically spent six months in Dublin just for writing purposes and, umm...I can't really remember exactly how it...how it came about but I remember I got the verse and the...bridge section and Steve said, "Oh, yeah, this sounds good" and just... | |
| Mensch | Is that the way it basically always comes out? | |
| Collen | Yeah, more or less. | |
| Mensch | With any basic song, is that someone might have a verse or a bridge section and someone else will add a chorus or something like that? | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | Is that, I mean, so... | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | Would you say that most songs on the Def Leppard album are joint efforts in terms of... | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | I mean, you know, with the exception of any instrumentals most of them are written with a combination of... | |
| Collen | Definitely. | |
| Mensch | ...two or three. | |
| 5:00 | Collen | Two heads are better than one. |
| Mensch | Didn't you find that it's easier to write with other people than, sort of, have to sit there and do it all by yourself? | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | Get stronger material that way... | |
| Collen | Yeah, definitely. | |
| Mensch | We want to know if you've got any, umm, favorite solos in any of the songs we do and, if so, umm, you know, how the solo came about if you could, you know, if you could try and explain that. | |
| Collen | Yeah, I like the Stage Fright solo on Pyromania, that's... | |
| Mensch | I mean, I mean, how did that come about? Now, the track was almost completed when you came in, basically, not before... | |
| Collen | Umm, yeah and Mutt said, "take this tape and just have a listen and come up with a solo" and I did. I just came in the next day and just...laid it down. | |
| Mensch | That was it. And you used that, you used your basic Destroyer for that. Was that through Marshalls again? | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | The same basic set up we have... | |
| Collen | Actually, that was through the live set up. | |
| Mensch | Was it? | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | Really? | |
| Collen | Yeah. The cold... | |
| Mensch | Twos and...and...and the three cabinets... | |
| Collen | Yeah, and that thing there. That cabinet there, I think | |
| Mensch | That cabinet there? | |
| Collen | The horrible blue thing. I don't know what it is but it's got...a simple Marshall cabinet. | |
| Mensch | Yeah, a modified Marshall cabinet. What about, uh, any other solos? | |
| Collen | Foolin's a cool solo, I think, as well. In fact, they're all really cool solos *laughs* I don't want to bore anyone. Rock of Ages is not bad, either *laughs* | |
| 6:03 | Mensch | Don't you play a solo on Photograph, too? |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | Yeah. What about Stage Fright? You sort of *unintelligible* it out yourself. | |
| Collen | Yeah. That one, umm, *unintelligible* | |
| 6:13 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 6:37 | Mensch | How important is...is image, for example, do you think is to a player? I mean, what do you think? Is there a good balance between the two of them? |
| Collen | Depends if you want to be in a successful rock band, really *laughs* | |
| Mensch | What do you...what do you...what do you think? What, you know, visual? Over, you know, more poses and notes? More notes and poses? Is there a happy medium? | |
| Collen | Uh, yeah, I think so. You've got to be able to play...fairly well so...and if you're really into guitar playing like I always were...always were...always was *laughs* | |
| Mensch | Right. | |
| Collen | ...then, um, that definitely helps. They've got a school, now, in England... | |
| 7:08 | Mensch | Do they? |
| Collen | ...to learn how to be a rock star. | |
| Mensch | Really? | |
| Collen | Yeah. I just heard about it. | |
| Mensch | That sounds... | |
| Collen | That sounds a bit dumb, actually, and a bit contrived, I think. Uh. The reason , I think, a lot of people like us is because it's fairly natural. I mean, we don't choreograph any stuff and it just happens. | |
| Mensch | And the clothes you wear are sort of... | |
| Collen | More or less as it happens, as well. | |
| Mensch | As it happens, also. Before we go on tour, you have to do a certain amount of training to get in shape? | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | Do you think it's important to be on shape because it's a long tour and you've got to basically last. | |
| Collen | Definitely. It catches up with you after a while. I mean, it sort of did last year but we managed to scrape through but being a year older... | |
| Mensch | You think to play, like, an eleven month tour, you basically have to have your act together... | |
| Collen | I think so, yeah. | |
| Mensch | ...physically because you've got to put out every night. | |
| Collen | Yeah. | |
| Mensch | And it's, you know... | |
| Collen | I'm running around, like I said before, you know, we're a bit more visual than most heavy metal bands so we, um, yeah, you've got to be in shape otherwise you'd be throwing up on the side of the stage every time. *unintelligible* | |
| 8:02 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 8:25 | Mensch | Can you give us any hints about what you and Steve are planning next year on stage? After all, you are known as the "Terror Twins of Rock". |
| Collen | Well... | |
| Mensch | We come to rock every night *laughs* | |
| Collen | Never go to the movies with Steve Clark because you will end up in a wall. | |
| Mensch | *laughs* Yes, I gather there's going to be some film of that during, you know, your solo break next year. The, um, Phil Collen Porsche incident in the wall. | |
| Collen | *laughs* | |
| Mensch | But is there anything on stage you guys planning? Have you got any new ideas? You know... | |
| Collen | Yeah, we've got this new stage design I haven't seen yet. *unintelligible* told me it was good. | |
| *laughter* | ||
| 9:02 | Mensch | Well, that's, uh...will you be a playing guitar solo on stage mext year, by the way? |
| Collen | On me own? | |
| Mensch | Yeah. | |
| Collen | Well, they're getting a bit boring. I mean, is the reason we don't do a drum solo because they're terribly cliched and monotonous...and guitar solos are a bit like that. So, we...me and Steve...are actually thinking about saying, "perhaps we can do it together". Actually, I shouldn't be telling you this because someone else is going to rip us off now *laughs* until we get on the tour. | |
| Mensch | But, I mean, in general, the solos you'll do will be incorporated into the songs. They won't be sort of your five minute, you know, ending of one song beginning of another song vibe. | |
| Collen | No, not really. | |
| Mensch | You don't think so. | |
| Collen | I don't think so, no. Maybe just slip a few bits in here and there. | |
| Mensch | Yeah. | |
| Collen | No twenty minute extravaganzas. | |
| Mensch | Any other fingering or picking techniques or anything like that you can, you can talk about? | |
| Collen | Yeah, umm, it...well, it depends how you learned. Well, I mean, I always learned like a...sort of like a jazz guitar player: alternative picking, up and down strokes and all that. But you mustn't get too carried away in...in the jazz feel otherwise it sounds... | |
| 10:03 | Mensch | Jazzy. |
| Collen | Yeah, and it doesn't fit in with rock and roll, you know. | |
| Mensch | Right. How loud is it, speaking of on stage sound, I mean, you know, you're an expert on the, you know, on the...sort of, live wars and stuff like that. I mean, is it important to be loud on stage? Soft on stage? You know, in terms of... | |
| Collen | Not really. | |
| Mensch | ...getting a good, live sound out front because, after all, that's what people came to hear. | |
| Collen | Yeah. Uh, depends on...how loud it takes to get your own sound. I mean, I...you know, I don't need, like, millions and millions of amps. And we're fairly quiet compared to a lot of rock bands... | |
| Mensch | Right. | |
| Collen | Other bands like Iron Maiden and that are really quite loud... | |
| Mensch | So, then, you think... | |
| Collen | ...as well. | |
| Mensch | You think it's helpful getting a good set up out front to keep a sound at a certain level on stage or it's just relative to how...what you want from your sound, basically. | |
| Collen | Yeah, it's relative to the sound. | |
| Mensch | So, I mean, are you louder, for example, than say Steve is because of the kind of sound you want compared to Steve? | |
| Collen | No, we've got exactly the same set up. | |
| 10:53 | Lasner | Be there and feel the power as Phill Collen and Ibanez rock the world in Def Leppard's upcoming tour and new album. |
| 11:00 | MUSIC INTERLUDE | |
| 11:16 | silence | |
| 11:23 | End of Side Two |
